-I think one thing we do know
is going to happen, I feel like mayor Pete Buttigieg
made this point well, that no matter who gets
the nomination, Donald Trump will say
they’re a socialist. -Yeah.
-How do as a — -And if he is identified —
this is from the latest crosstabs on the poll. Crosstabs are the explanations behind the numbers
that we report. If the president runs
against somebody who can be reasonably identified
as socialist — There is no punchline on this,
by the way. I know that face.
It’s not going to be funny. [ Laughter ]
-Oh, oh, oh. This is going to be good, yeah. -Then he wins by at least
six points. -Uh-huh.
-So Pete Buttigieg,
who is obviously very smart, is right about that,
and we see it in the numbers. Make your point.
-Well, I — My only point was how do you defend against — You’re going to run against
a person who is not going to make
his decision. He will call Pete Buttigieg
a socialist just as much as he will call Bernie Sanders
a socialist. -Yes.
-Even though that they are very far apart, I would think, in so far as how
they view themselves. So how do you protect against
a guy who basically is playing by back alley rules?
-Here’s the answer. Well, one,
that is not new in politics. Labels are very helpful
as a point of persuasion and as a point of opposition. But the goal is,
you call me what you want. I’m talking to them. Yes, I hear him, especially
in this coming election. I hear him. He’s noise to me. I want to talk to you. This is what you
need to know about me. This is what I know about you.
This is why I’m doing this. Let him say what he wants to
say. That’s the goal. Will you be able
to achieve that? It’s difficult. You will have a harder time
doing it if you haven’t
gotten ready for it. If you want to have
a meaningful discussion about race in this country,
which is so hard, because what we forgot isn’t
that we have these problems in this society, is that we
forgot that we had been trying to change culture to suppress
the animus, that we’re not going to
give you an audience if you want to say ugly things. We’re not going to
play into your division. That’s what has returned,
not the problems. So if you want to have
a meaningful discussion, but people have had to watch
months of you almost play the same issues out
with your own people, who are supposed to be opposing
what is on the other side of it, you don’t think
there’s going to be fatigue? You don’t think that
when you get to the general, you’re not allowing
your opponent to say, “But, Seth,
you call everybody this. You say everybody is a racist.
You say everything is racial. When does it end?” Why mitigate the strength
of something that matters so much
just for political convenience and advantage right now. I really don’t get
where their heads are at, hence my closing questions. -You’ve got —
Booker, you thought did a good job last night. You thought Castro
did a good job last night. -That’s what
the Iowa caucus voters said. I have no opinion. -Okay.
[ Laughter ] -I tell you what I don’t like. Here’s what I don’t like.
I’ll be honest. It will stay in this room.
[ Laughter ] [ Laughs ] The idea that — Look, man,
you’ve got to pick your spots and why you’re going to attack.
I know Cory Booker. He’s a man of integrity.
He believes in public service. He’s very smart
and very committed. You’re going to go after Biden
about his record, you have one, too. You were the mayor of Newark,
very tough city, inherited big problems. The crime bills that
you’re talking about were about big problems
that came from cities like Newark
all over the country. There were things
that didn’t happen the way you wanted them to. There were things that happened
the way Biden didn’t — If you’re attacking yourselves
on that level, again, it is time wasted that you could
have been going after your real opponent, as you say, and you are weakening
both of yourselves potentially. Because you’re allowing
the opponent — Let’s say Cory Booker,
Senator Booker, gets it. You don’t think that the
opponent’s going to say, “I saw you on the stage there
with Biden. I remember him saying that you
were a terrible mayor. You couldn’t
take care of anybody. You did a lot of stop-and-frisk. You’re giving ammunition
to your opponent. They keep saying we don’t want
to fight with each other, and then that’s exactly what
they do. -So do you think they should
behave the same way you’re arguing
they will have to behave when it’s up against
Donald Trump, and do the same thing, which is when they get asked
a question that specifically mentions what an opponent said,
even in a Democratic debate, be like, “You know what?
I’m not here to talk about what…
-First of all, that’s what they all
have always done. There is a misconception,
I believe, in the party right now
about what they need to be proving to you guys. I think if they were more like
Brother Quay over there, they’d be better off. The simplicity of his shirt
gives a complete message. Right?
-There you go. [ Cheers and applause ]
There you go. -When did you hear that
in earnest last night? When did somebody — just think
about how you’d feel, okay, if I asked the question,
“So, Seth, you going to tax
the middle class or not? How are you going to pay? You
going to tax the middle class?” And he’s like, “Well, maybe,
but no, but see — And I want you to understand
this, in the plan on page 19, I say that I’m going to get to
it on page 27, and — What’s that?!”
Whish! That’s what you saw last night.
But imagine if he’d say, look, here’s what
I want to achieve with it. What we have now isn’t enough. What we have now
have people not being covered. What we have now
is financial insecurity. We have to get back
to covering more people and doing it in a way
where the companies win less than you do as the patient. And that’s what I’m going
to spend my time doing. I have a plan with how to do it. We’ll figure out how we get it
done exactly once I get there. Are you unsatisfied? -That was very satisfying.
-One guy. [ Laughter ] One guy, everybody else stays
home. -That’s great.
-Four more years. Settled. Next question. -That’s John Delaney numbers
out there. [ Laughter ]
-That’s right. -I want to ask one last question
’cause you are also finding some time for
a little recreation. You were fishing.
-Yes. -This is a fluke
that you caught? -No, it was completely
intentional. [ Scattered groans, laughter ] [ Cheers and applause ] Come on, a little bit of you — a little bit, you like it.
-I feel like you set me up. I feel like I’m going to
find out later this was just Photoshopped.
It was a sea bass. -At home, I wear this suit.
I don’t know who that is. It was weird. Did you know
that you didn’t cover up your bicep with the fish?
[ Laughter ] I know you’re very — I know
you’re real shy about your arms. [ Laughter ] -My arms are like
my least impressive part. -Oh, boy.
[ Audience oohs, laughter ] Get out of here!
Chris Cuomo, everybody!